Dec 10, 2001

anyone tried anything lower than 7.0 grains? need filler?
Re: Blue Dot & 17 Mach IV -- Rich in VA		Top of thread	Archive

Posted by: Rich in VA ^Ž
12/11/2001, 05:13:24

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You've gotta try V V N310....
Re: anyone tried anything lower than 7.0 grains? need filler? -- Rich in VA		Top of thread	Archive

Posted by: Mike in PA
12/18/2001, 13:52:02

No filler needed. 17machIV w/22" Blackstar barrel(Sako 491, blue/grey laminate sporter).Using CCI 400 std primers. 20 gr V-max/moly:

2.5 gr---1409 fps
3.0------1714
3.5------1941
4.0------2165

For small game season (grey squirrels), I've settled on the 3.0 gr load. This load actually will put five in one hole (and I mean one ragged hole) at 50 yds. It duplicates the energy of a somewhat hot .22LR with a much flatter trajectory and a whole bunch less drift.

It's so much fun to turn my Stony Pt turrets (atop VariX III 4.5-14) to this load setting for very quiet and very deadly accuracy (I keep it zeroed for 30 yds, and this allows holding on the squirrel's head from 15 yds on out to 80 yds). Should I see something like a fall turkey (or some other big varmint), a simple turn of turrets back to zero and I'm set to send these same V-Max pills out at 4,050 fps. (I do have to admit that lately I've gone to Starke 25's at 3,800--have shot a .338 7-shot, 100 yd. group, with these).

Anyway--it's all good.
Mike

INTERESTING
Re: You've gotta try V V N310.... -- Mike in PA		Top of thread	Archive

Posted by: jim saubier
12/20/2001, 07:55:02

How much elevation do you have to add for you powerhouse load? Have you ever stuck a bullet in the barrel? That is lower than I have heard of anybody going, and from your accuracy it sounds like you must have pretty consistent velocities. Sounds like some pretty neat stuff, I'd love to hear more.

I MISREAD your post. I thought that you were talking about n130, when you were referring to n310 - a pistol powder I am told.

Modified by jim saubier at Fri, Dec 21, 2001, 12:41:01

Re: INTERESTING
Re: INTERESTING -- jim saubier		Top of thread	Archive

Posted by: Mike in PA
12/20/2001, 21:41:19

At first glance, a 30 yd zero (reduced load) would seem mighty far from the 100 yd (full power load)...but that reduced load at 30 yds also crosses zero at 73 yds (the arc of trajectory is rising at 30 and falling at 73, while both hit zero at these distances). The full power load is still very much at the rise of its arc as it crosses 100 yds for zero....without adjusting turrets, there is only 1.5" disparity at 100 yds from load to load.
(Btw, the reduced load's highest point, or top of arc, is at 50 yds, at only .33" from zero.)
So cool.

N310 came as a result of a number of emails from a fellow I'd run across over 2 years ago on the net...my Mach IV was a while coming, so I culled as much load info as possible over two years. He'd described N310 as having very similar characteristics to a smokeless powder used by WWII Germany in suppressed Mauser rifles. He felt the pressure curve to be just right for the Mach IV case, with only a little more volume than the .357 Maximum...sort of a necked down handgun round. He advised using a very mild primer like the CCI, instead of the usual Rem 7.5 (possibly too hot a primer for this); also advised lightweight bullets for this. He'd experimented with N310 with the .223, 300 Whisper, and the .308...all to great success.

This was long before Blue Dot loads were ever mentioned...and actually, this fellow felt Blue Dot might be likely for low load density detonation--of course, with the number of folks using it now, this doesn't seem all that likely anymore.

I've never had a bullet stuck in the barrel...these definitely go off with as much authority as needed to make it through. Moly could be lending a helping hand. (I once had a bullet stay behind on an unfired, chambered round....I'd been seating into the lands with near to zero neck tension, like the PPC's, and despite great accuracy, there didn't seem to be enough to gain by doing so.)

After trying all loads previously listed at 50 yds, with very nice cloverleafs, the 3.0 gr load stood head and shoulders above the others with its ragged hole groups...so, I settled there and looked things over with my ballistics program to see just where I stood as far as optimum trajectory and zero, ft-lbs energy, drift,etc.

A final note to add to how sweet this set-up is....just as an arbitrary starting point, I kept my seating die adjusted the same as with 25 gr Starkes...and the little 20's did just what I've already described from the start with no other seating depth change. (The sweet spot is well away from the lands, unlike any other rifle I own).

A subnote: I have the 100 yd zero for my woods hunting zero, for turkeys and such...somewhat thick PA woods don't often open up much beyond that around here (and it's illegal to stalk them, so I'm more likely to spy them at distance, than walk up on one)-Steady Sticks are a real delightful addition to this combination in the woods; for the times where I do have longer shooting opportunities, I have a zero adjustment chart in my pocket. For summer fun with groundhogs, the 6.5-20 Leupold and Harris bipod go on for 300 yds+ (that's where the .260 Improved takes over, and when its killing energy peters out at 500, next comes the 6.5-284.)

Hope this doesn't all sound like tall tales....all truth, no reason for anything else.

Mike in PA