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  #11  
Old 06-21-2019, 02:51 PM
rick w. rick w. is offline
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The English is nice, not readily available really other than custom blanks. The other is more common off shelf. But I like the English.........I don't know what the 38 market will really do, the spec boys are already hyping it; but sometimes that takes a while to come about or really keep value beyond the oh boy initial point. Might be a good time to let the wanna be spec-ers to belly up huh?

Last edited by rick w.; 06-21-2019 at 02:53 PM.
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  #12  
Old 06-21-2019, 04:23 PM
Teddy Bear Rat Teddy Bear Rat is offline
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I appreciate the sage advise from all.

Rick: Do you really think the English walnut sporter is the more unique, and the VE closer to common off-the-shelf? I was leaning heavily toward the VE, but mostly because of the smaller action and the colors. Yet, as I look at the action size, there really isn't that much difference...and the later action is definitely improved. As mentioned, the bolt operation seems smoother, and the ejector design appears more sound. The bolt stop/release also works and looks better on the later rifles -- Cooper changed them for a reason. The cased colors were a love-at-first sight thing but could be mere infatuation, and we know the colors will fade over time...just like those first feelings of teenage love . I was never really a big fan of color case hardening, anyway, even in classic single shots and shotguns, especially on top of engraving...kind of a confused, mottled look. These particular colors are prettier than most, though, and that appears to be swaying my judgment.
A couple more pics:




Thanks

TBR

Last edited by Teddy Bear Rat; 06-21-2019 at 06:49 PM.
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  #13  
Old 06-21-2019, 04:49 PM
rick w. rick w. is offline
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TBR,

My opinion is just that, just one of the many............opinions like mine are hopefully respected, not any mandate or whatever...........just offerings of conversation about fine rifles.

One could buy Ruger No.1's with heavy flame and fiddleback back in the day, and on occasion now(scarce) fwiw. I reckon I favor English, the streaking and contrast always kills me. Heavily contrasted English/streaked to me would be the one I would keep, but already said that......... Marble Cake Claro can rival in looks but is relatively soft.

I hope my offering of opinion did not overly sway; not my intent, there are attributes to both rifles that are worth pondering at length. gotta like case hardening, you either do or don't, I left it when the greens went away(for a fair reason really; deadly stuff in some cases).

Kinda boils down to listening to opinions graciously given by folks here, then putting your own preferences to work. Probably kinda hard to let either one go, but been there and done that a time or two.

Tis good to have problems like these two rifles............... I sincerely appreciate getting to see both..........

regards,

Rick W.

Last edited by rick w.; 06-21-2019 at 04:52 PM.
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  #14  
Old 06-22-2019, 03:32 AM
Teddy Bear Rat Teddy Bear Rat is offline
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Just measured the bolt and receiver on both rifles. The newer English walnut rifle is larger by this much:
Loading port: .152
Bolt notch to front of receiver: .170
Bolt: .230, but some of the difference is sunk into the receiver ring.
Handle front to rear of locking lugs: .175
Receiver ring : same
So, barely 1/8, maybe not worth worrying about. For some reason, the VE would be easier for me to shoot and render it to fired condition, perhaps due to its utilitarian configuration???
I also believe the checkering on the VE is slightly finer, as in more LPI.

The English walnut rifle handles so well and just looks so good overall, whereas the VE just has nice features; overall not so much.
Leaning toward the sporter, but now Im thinking it would be the easier to sell.

The dilemma continues.
TBR
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  #15  
Old 06-22-2019, 02:01 PM
Gary in Illinois Gary in Illinois is offline
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You could always send me the loser for safekeeping! When you change your mind, I would be happy to swap back for a while.

Surprised no one has offered before.
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  #16  
Old 06-22-2019, 11:18 PM
DittoHead DittoHead is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Teddy Bear Rat View Post
Just measured the bolt and receiver on both rifles. The newer English walnut rifle is larger by this much:
Loading port: .152
Bolt notch to front of receiver: .170
Bolt: .230, but some of the difference is sunk into the receiver ring.
Handle front to rear of locking lugs: .175
Receiver ring : same
So, barely 1/8, maybe not worth worrying about.
The M38 action was originally designed for cartridges based on the Hornet case. Later it was modified to accommodate cartridges based on the Fireball case. In addition to the dimensional changes, the lugs were beefed up to handle the higher pressure.
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  #17  
Old 06-23-2019, 01:16 AM
Danny Danny is offline
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Wonderful rifles. I read your posting, but do not remember if you listed a reason for selling.

Personally, unless you have a dire need to sell those for financial reasons, I would not sell either. It is now difficult enough to find Cooper Model 38s, especially like those. You might not ever get a chance to replace them with equals if you sell them.

Personally, if they were mine, and only if I had to, I would first sell the sporter weight one, and that is for reasons concerning the other being a varmint weight gun AND the custom touches. You, however prefer the sporter weight arms, so deciding which to keep will have to be a personal decision you make for yourself. I wish I could offer more help on that part, but these things always come down to the individual having to make their own choice. Good luck.
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  #18  
Old 06-23-2019, 02:55 AM
Teddy Bear Rat Teddy Bear Rat is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DittoHead View Post
The M38 action was originally designed for cartridges based on the Hornet case. Later it was modified to accommodate cartridges based on the Fireball case. In addition to the dimensional changes, the lugs were beefed up to handle the higher pressure.
Was already aware of this, which is why I was looking for the earlier Hornet-specific action, but there really isnt as much dimensional difference as I thought.
Of course, I know its a personal decision, but I guess I would like to know which the enthusiasts here would find most desirable, or easiest to sell for the most; however, the more I look at the English walnut sporter, the more certain I am it will stay and the VE will go down the road. No hurry, really, and maybe Ill just bide my time, but I really want to shoot one of these!!!
I appreciate the input.
TBR
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  #19  
Old 06-23-2019, 09:25 PM
Danny Danny is offline
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Myself, I would be more inclined to purchase the Montana Varminter if I saw it up for sale here, but the bolt handle is on the wrong side for me. I wish I could find a 38 like that, however, I am lucky enough that I grabbed one almost as nice years ago. Mine has a fantastic French Walnut stock, highly figured, but without the the custom metal touches found on yours.
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  #20  
Old 07-08-2019, 03:13 PM
flyrod flyrod is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Teddy Bear Rat View Post
ARRRG!!...it has the more recent, slightly longer action.
Well, your initial interest in the M38 was for the action, right? I would suggest you stick with that and choose the shorter one you wanted in the first place. As you pointed out, even the 'heavy' varmint features are still light in comparison to most others. And you could trim it down if you can't stand it. The stock and barrel could be slimmed down or replaced and you could then check all the boxes for your ideal setup. With the other one, this would not be possible and the less-than-ideal receiver would always remain a small thorn, right? I don't think you would have any trouble selling either one.

Thanks for sharing the pictures!
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