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  #11  
Old 02-21-2019, 11:16 PM
South Pender South Pender is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by flyrod View Post
I was happy to see them move away from PRK but the new owners do seem to be more interested in making money than in making bullets. Their new location should in theory precipitate lower prices. Perhaps the price of materials has gone way up?
I've purchased some Berger bullets over the years, but haven't known about their corporate structure. Who are PRK? If I'm not mistaken (and I may be), don't NAMMO (Vihtavuori, Lapua) now own Berger Bullets?

Has large corporate ownership by a company like NAMMO resulted in a decline in the quality over what it was when Walt Berger was running things?
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  #12  
Old 02-21-2019, 11:48 PM
Gary in Illinois Gary in Illinois is offline
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I am amazed at the failure of people to understand how business works! An investor buys stock in a business looking to maximize the value of that investment. This, quite simply, is the company’s goal. If they can make all of their customers happy in accomplishing their goal, everyone is happy. If production capacity must be diverted from low volume products to higher volume products to accomplish their charter then that is what their owners expect and demand. Small caliber shooters are very small fish in a very large pond. It seems very simple and straightforward...

I really miss several of the bullets Berger used to make but I am not personally offended by rational business decisions. We have people criticizing Ford and GM for “abandoning” the sedan market but can we really expect the auto makers to continue production of vehicles that have become very slow selling.

Two things I would like Berger to do is to announce products that they plan to discontinue several months in advance to allow shooters the opportunity to stockpile their chosen bullets. The second is for Berger to make limited runs of some of these bullets as they have the opportunity to work them into production - the way some brass producers do with low volume cartridge brass.
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  #13  
Old 02-22-2019, 12:07 AM
Bayou City Boy Bayou City Boy is offline
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Good post, Gary.

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  #14  
Old 02-22-2019, 12:18 AM
albertacoyotecaller albertacoyotecaller is offline
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Yes agreed, good post.
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  #15  
Old 02-22-2019, 12:20 AM
Eagle_view Eagle_view is offline
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Gary, thank you for your statement. It is well put.

The only reason to market to the nation is to make money. If you think that there is a business opportunity, well then, take advantage of their failure to see the opportunity.

Get you a couple of bright young guys that now material science and die design/manufacturing have them help you make some dies. You might find that you need to make the jackets too, since you will now be a competitor.

Hydraulics and pneumatics will allow you to build less expensive and faster presses. The great thing now is that we have the internet and you can find suppliers for copper and Lead alloys much easier than we used to.

Well maybe you shouldn't even look at lead, it is a dying market. So maybe you will need to look at copper wire and forming dies.

Rent a building someplace you can setup a range to test fire your products, get licensed up, find box manufacturing company, call SHOT SHOW and beg for a display booth.

Start cranking out your bullets, send them off to every magazine, shooting and reloading writer.

Start signing up for ad space in all the magazines. It is cheaper if you contract a year at a time, figure $125.00 per column inch.

It is hard to catch attention with less than a 2 x 4" Add. Pay someone with experience to design the ads for you.

Early on, take some trips to Wyoming, Montana, Nevada, Oregon and shoot a lot of Prairie Dogs, Sage Rats, Gophers, add a few coyotes, and maybe some Texas Hogs. Enjoy these trips because once you get things rolling that will be the last vacation you will get for a decade.

Let me know when you have things running and I will tell you that the old Berger bullets were better and I am now shooting only Hornady Bullets and won't buy any other.

Opportunity knocks guys, Other people are doing it, join the fun.

Guys, I am only half kidding.

Lowell
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  #16  
Old 02-22-2019, 12:21 AM
AlbertaAl AlbertaAl is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gary in Illinois View Post
I am amazed at the failure of people to understand how business works! An investor buys stock in a business looking to maximize the value of that investment. This, quite simply, is the company’s goal. If they can make all of their customers happy in accomplishing their goal, everyone is happy. If production capacity must be diverted from low volume products to higher volume products to accomplish their charter then that is what their owners expect and demand. Small caliber shooters are very small fish in a very large pond. It seems very simple and straightforward...

I really miss several of the bullets Berger used to make but I am not personally offended by rational business decisions. We have people criticizing Ford and GM for “abandoning” the sedan market but can we really expect the auto makers to continue production of vehicles that have become very slow selling.

Two things I would like Berger to do is to announce products that they plan to discontinue several months in advance to allow shooters the opportunity to stockpile their chosen bullets. The second is for Berger to make limited runs of some of these bullets as they have the opportunity to work them into production - the way some brass producers do with low volume cartridge brass.
please don't insult our integrity ...we have a right to feel the way we do !
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  #17  
Old 02-22-2019, 12:38 AM
UTcaller UTcaller is offline
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Has anyone tried Reeds bullets on Coyotes? I just bought 200 of the 25 grain VLD hollowpoints, and they look exactly like the 25 grain Berger Match bullets I have left. Even have the same b.c .199. I’m hoping they kill Coyotes the same too. If so I will load up on them for long time future use.
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  #18  
Old 02-22-2019, 12:55 AM
Gary in Illinois Gary in Illinois is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AlbertaAl View Post
please don't insult our integrity ...we have a right to feel the way we do !
Not sure I understand your point but you certainly do have the right to your feelings. It wasn’t my intention to insult anyone - just wanted to point out the reality causing some of these changes.

I am as disappointed as anyone at Berger’s changes. I have been around a while and I used to shoot 15, 18, 20, 22, 25, 30 and 37 grain 17 caliber Berger bullets; now I can choose only from the 25 grain bullet.

I built a new rifle last year specifically for the 20 caliber 55 grain Berger and I don’t even have a load worked up for it yet! Sure I am disappointed but realistically, Berger was pretty good to the small bore shooters for quite a number of years.

Vote with your wallet and buy from another supplier. If the impact on Berger’s bottom line is great enough maybe they will revive some of the bullets, but I won’t be holding my breath (very small fish in very large pond!)
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  #19  
Old 02-22-2019, 12:57 AM
rickiesrevenge rickiesrevenge is offline
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While I completely understand Gary's position that would lead one to think that they were actually producing other bullets. Which simply isn't the case. Go looking for any 140gr 6.5mm, 105gr hybrids, etc bullets during the competition season??? They simply didn't exist! Since the move they have lost market share. Other companies like Hornady and Sierra have really stepped up their game and are making bullets with higher BC's which consumers seem to favor these days. Competitors have switched to sierra for match bullets and may or may not look back at berger once they finally get the wheels back on the cart. Others have switched to custom bullets as the price of bergers isn't far off custom bullets.

I don't see the need to ever buy another berger product. They've lost me as a customer forever. Not just because discontinuing bullets but the way they did it. Like you said they could do a limited run from time to time. But that aint gonna happen, I asked. As far as the bigger diameter hunting bullets they suck. I've shot quite a few animals with them and its a crap shoot whats gonna happen. MUCH better options in that arena too.

Just my two cents

Aaron
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  #20  
Old 02-22-2019, 02:27 AM
DRS DRS is offline
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They lost me when they recommended a 7.5 twist barrel to shoot the 20 cal. 55gr. bullets out of a 20 Dasher. I ask a couple times if they were sure because of the velocity of the Dasher. They strongly recommended the 7.5 twist. Well when the bullets started to come apart before reaching the target the guy that recommended that twist to me pretty much lied to me for eight months through e-mail saying they were looking into it and would resolve the problem for me. In the end they did nothing and I am stuck with a real high priced tomato stake.
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