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  #1  
Old 11-19-2017, 04:43 PM
AzSam AzSam is offline
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Default Swaging, worth it or not.

Good morning,

This not something I been yearning for but, but I have the opportunity to pick up a complete swagging set up in 22 cal with all of dies to form from 22LR cases, core mold, press, for about 1K. My question is, for those who do it, or have done it, Is the end result worth the time and effort. Is the end result better than buying projectiles in bulk in terms or what can be expected accuracy wise. I don't shoot benchrest, or spray and pray with an AR.

Part of me says do it, the other says I can buy over 10K varmint nightmares and Hornadys from midsouth for the same amount. Than again, I could expand into other calibers, sometime later on.

Appreciate the feedback/input.

Alll the best,

Michael.
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  #2  
Old 11-19-2017, 05:02 PM
pertnear pertnear is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AzSam View Post
...Part of me says do it, the other says I can buy over 10K varmint nightmares and Hornadys from midsouth for the same amount. Than again, I could expand into other calibers, sometime later on...
Your statement indeed highlights the swager's dilemma. I got into swaging .224 cal bullets back before the election when I could see the anti-gun/ammo controversy getting a lot of lip service by liberal politics. It's nice to know you can make 'em if ya need 'em. Also it seemed like a good investments. If you ever want to sell your dies & equipment, recouping most of your investment is pretty easy. Also if you enjoy reloading, swaging is a nice extension of that hobby. I like to use swaging as a good winter project cranking out bullets to shoot in the summer. This is all rationalization on my part, but it helped push me over the edge to spend about $1,000 to try it. If you enjoy your shooting hobbies, I say give it a try!

Dave

Last edited by pertnear; 11-19-2017 at 10:12 PM.
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  #3  
Old 11-20-2017, 12:37 AM
georgeld georgeld is offline
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From what swaged bullets I've seen they've all been soft lead.
Those have to be fired SLOW or they'll lead a bore bad, especially in the
smaller cals.

Like you said, a grand will buy a big pile of jacketed bullets.

Casting is much cheaper and just about as fast, plus you can make 'em hard enough to shoot at a decent velocity without leading a decently smooth bore. IF it's a bit rough, you'll still get leading of course.

I cast by the 2 gallon buckets full per caliber, but, only for pistols and use
recycled bullet metal that's about as hard as I can barely mark with a thumb nail. They don't lead a decently polished bore. I have a K-38 with well over 10,000 thru it since the last patch and no sign of leading. I just wipe the soot off the outside. I haven't had much luck with cast slugs in rifles other that M/L's. I have shot with a couple guys that did real well with hard cast in rifles. One of them was the top shooter in our CMP matches for years til he moved away. A couple times even with MY rifles.

Your money, your decision.
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Last edited by georgeld; 11-20-2017 at 02:28 AM.
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  #4  
Old 11-20-2017, 12:51 AM
Bill K Bill K is offline
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Default Swaging worth it or not ?

I believe he is talking about jacketed swaged bullets George, with the jacket being made from fired 22lr case/brass.
I had a shooting buddy, a few years back, that did it that way and they worked very well in our 222 Remingtons on various critters/varmints. Bill K
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  #5  
Old 11-20-2017, 02:29 AM
georgeld georgeld is offline
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Bill: IF that's the case, then it's a whole different deal.
I've loaded and shot quite a few of those and they did well for me on
p/dogs. I still have quite a bunch of bullets made that way.

When such is discussed it needs to be Clarified from the first.

Thanks Bill.
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it's about CONTROL!!"
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  #6  
Old 11-20-2017, 03:05 AM
Bayou City Boy Bayou City Boy is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill K View Post
I believe he is talking about jacketed swaged bullets George, with the jacket being made from fired 22lr case/brass.
I had a shooting buddy, a few years back, that did it that way and they worked very well in our 222 Remingtons on various critters/varmints. Bill K

Quote:
Originally Posted by georgeld View Post
Bill: IF that's the case, then it's a whole different deal.
I've loaded and shot quite a few of those and they did well for me on
p/dogs. I still have quite a bunch of bullets made that way.

When such is discussed it needs to be Clarified from the first.

Thanks Bill.
George, the OP did clarify "from the first"......... You just missed it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by AzSam View Post
Good morning,

This not something I been yearning for but, but I have the opportunity to pick up a complete swagging set up in 22 cal with all of dies to form from 22LR cases, core mold, press, for about 1K. My question is, for those who do it, or have done it, Is the end result worth the time and effort. Is the end result better than buying projectiles in bulk in terms or what can be expected accuracy wise. I don't shoot benchrest, or spray and pray with an AR.

Part of me says do it, the other says I can buy over 10K varmint nightmares and Hornadys from midsouth for the same amount. Than again, I could expand into other calibers, sometime later on.

Appreciate the feedback/input.

Alll the best,

Michael.
BTW - What the OP is describing with bullet jackets made from 22LR cases is how Vernon Speer got into the bullet making business years ago............ He sold his bullets packaged in cloth tobacco pouches. They give decent accuracy, but typically not the accuracy that can be achieved with well-formed concentric bullet jackets.

From experience, bullet swaging is not a fun hobby as it is very repetitive and requires a very close attention to detail to make good bullets. I bought in full bore to make 20 caliber bullets for myself when they were scarce years ago. Today it's far easier and more fun for me to go to the GS and just buy bullets off the shelf. YMMV.

-BCB
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Last edited by Bayou City Boy; 11-20-2017 at 03:25 AM.
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  #7  
Old 11-21-2017, 01:26 AM
georgeld georgeld is offline
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BCB:
sure as hell!

Some years ago when I first got this nice lathe I turned a bunch of
dies and such to make a lead wire press. Man it sure put out fine 1/2"
wire about 16" long from a 1# ingot. Only thing, the ram got stuck in
the barrel, still is!!

I used a 20ton hydraulic jack and heavy steel frame. It's all still out there
yet.
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it's about CONTROL!!"
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  #8  
Old 11-21-2017, 12:35 PM
The Old Redneck The Old Redneck is offline
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Default swaging

Swaging can produce benchrest quality bullets with right dies and materials. You can buy jackets that are better quality than 22 hulls make. The 22 hulls used to make jackets work and make good bullets. You will spend extra time cleaning and forming them. Also to get better quality jackets from the 22 hulls they need to be sorted. All hulls are not the same. I like Eley hulls for subcaliber plinking bullets. Swaging gives you the ability to make things you can't buy, that said if you are wanting bulk lots of good bullets that are a common factory production swaging is a waste of your time. I buy bullets in bulk of common things I shoot. The bullet press is only used for thing I can't buy. Jackets and lead wire are bought in bulk. I only form jackets I can't buy and then from jackets I bought in bulk usually. To me the 22 hulls require too much prep time for the savings. Reforming a factory jacket takes less time and gives better results. The question you need to ask yourself is where would you rather spend your time and money. You can load a round in less time than it takes to make a bullet. The cost of good jackets in bulk runs with bulk bullet cost. Call around and price pure lead wire, faster than casting cores, and jackets. It is doubtful your savings, if any will pay for cost of equipment. Then time involved making quality bullets will eat up your nornal time spent reloading. After you cast or cut lead wire cores you will also see why some buy cores in bulk. I'm not against bullet swaging, I do it. Have also bought a lot of stuff from folks that got sick of it and sold out Cheap. I would much rather buy bullets than make them. I can reload most rounds I less time than it takes to make a quality bullet. To make bullets that are not quality is a waste of time, powder, primers etc. You will get out of swaging what you put into it.
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  #9  
Old 11-21-2017, 03:56 PM
moorepower moorepower is offline
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The moral of the story is when political times are good, stock up on bullets, brass, and certain ammo. These swaged bullets from a .22lr case are probably more explosive than an SX, but not as accurate. I could see if you shot a ton of .22H, such a ground squirrels on a frequent basis, but as cheap as the VG, SX and even Zmax are, it's really hard to justify the effort.
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  #10  
Old 11-22-2017, 04:14 AM
georgeld georgeld is offline
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MP:
A lot of us old retired guys have more time on our hands
than we have projects sometimes. I had a 5 gal bucket full of polished and
sorted 22lr cases at the time I made that lead wire press. I was planning on getting into it hard.

When I got waylaid, found a guy on the old ammobrasstrader.com board that was in it
and couldn't find brass. I sent him two full big F/R boxes in trade for 5000 bullets.
That was back when 70lb F/R boxes could be sent less than ten bucks. He was tickled!
They shot fine for my needs on p/dogs. Still have a bunch of 'em yet.
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"Gun Control is NOT about guns,
it's about CONTROL!!"

Last edited by georgeld; 11-22-2017 at 04:22 AM. Reason: fixings
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