17 AH to 17 HH

[Alan in GA]

After years of 'wanting', I built a .458 American/.458x2" on a Ruger 77 Mark II action. It was given a 'boost' when I saw a take off barrel in a local gun shop, a Ruger #3 barrel with the factory open sights, and in .45/70. Measured this, measured that, and figured it would work out perfect for a .458 American on a Ruger short action 77MII I had {after a lot of time in the lathe}.
Two months later Marlin announced their .450 Marlin, identical except for the longer 'case belt'. Factory cases and dies came out soon after.
If I were building my long time dream .458 American AGAIN, would I use the hard to find reamer and custom dies? Heck no, I'd make the 'for all practiacal purposes' gun in .450 Marlin and use cheap 'standard' dies and brass.
Same same 17AH/17HH........ at least I think...cause we STILL ain't seen the final round! : )
Just think......no gopher has EVER seen the headstamp of the round that killed it.

[StrombeckJ]

Just spoke with KW. His reamer was cut at the same time along with Savages by Dave. He eyeballed the 22HH, 17AH & 17HH. It appears to be shorter in the neck by 30 thou, besides the diff in shoulder angle. This was holding them up and eyeballing them. He is expecting the Diagram soon and will forward me a copy.

I will post when received.

Jon

[montdoug]

A little poking around on Hornady's web site and seeing their info and there really isn't that much left to wonder about. 25 degree shoulder instead of the .17 Ackleys 30 degree. Looks to be a bit wider in the body and a titch shorter. Just enough alteration to put their name on it and not be accused of stealing P.O. Ackleys round.
In comparable quality chambers, barrels and barrel lengths I'll lay odds there ain't a diddly-do-da's worth of difference. Alan's point about the dies is a great one MidSouth is showing Hornady's 2 die set for the new .17 Hornet for $33.50. MidSouth only shows one die for the .17 Ackley which is an S-Bushing neck die at $129.00. Graf and Son does have a .17 Ackley 2 die set, it's Reddings and is considered a "custom die set" That means they have a license to gouge your eye out , it's $156.79 and anymore I personally prefer the Hornady dies over Reddings at even money much less at at $123.29 more. Personal opinion only.
As I posted a while back, if CZ makes one I'll buy it.

P.S.
They have 25 round boxes of ammo for $19.99 so that's slightly less than the .17 Fire Ball was anyway.

[Alan in GA]

Ok, I have to post this little mind matter: I always considered anything "ACKLEY" to have a 40 degree shoulder, and have wondered why P.O. used 30 on our favorite gopher control round!
So, the 17 Hornady might not be an ACKLEY design exactly, but the 'ol 17AH isn't exactly what I consider to be an ACKLEY improved EITHER!
I think the long neck of the 17AH is key to case life, but HAVE considered blowing out the 17AH even more to a shorter neck that is one caliber long, and 40 degree shoulders.
This wonderful and ingenious thinkin' never got past mind thoughts, but I've considered it many times over the last dozen years. Every time I bring this idea out audibly, my gun buddy's give me that look, as though I've just wasted some breath and thought matter thinking of fixing something that ain't broke : )

Just for reference:
http://stevespages.com/jpg/cd17ackleyhornet.jpg

[Iowa17Cal]

Umm. Was remembering that I bought several boxes of 22 Hornady Hornets about three years ago to run through my Browning 1885 just to see what the stuff was like. It shot good and reloads shot to the same POI which had never happened to me before.
I took about 100 of those cases and formed, then fire formed them to 17AH.
They also shot as good as anything else I had and better than some.
That memory plus this current thread has me wondering how likely it would be that Hornady would come up with a "different" case just for their 17 HH?
Probably not, is my guess.
Would be a separate set of control and production issues.
If we could only get our hands on a few of the cases... .
Soon, I've heard.
John

[montdoug]

Alan if it ain't broke don't fix it . Instead of leaning on the Hornet case any harder than we already do with the .17 Ackley might I suggest ya do a Bee, a lot more stout. I'm downloading the .17 Killer Bee (40 degree shoulder ) in deference to my old 1885 action strength and still exceeding the .17 Ackley Hornets abilities with 25 grain V-Max's.

John You're right on target. Hornady says on their web site video that they altered the .22 Hornet case, they'd a been crazy not to financially.