Buyer beware Neil Jones just raped me

[Qaz]

Gary- you were not raped. I knew a girl in college that was raped, completely different experience. You got f-d a little bit, but not raped. Your only real complaint is that the name was spelled wrong, the inside dimensions are not correct and it needs some polishing. George sounds like the voice of reason to me.

qaz

[GLWenzl]

You are not only 100% correct Qaz and even though I didn’t mean it literally, it was a very horrible choice of a word to use. And I regret using it. If I could have changed the title, I would have done so. I was hurting pretty bad when I made this post but still should have known better. Probably end up deleting this post sometime and thank you for calling me out on it.

My complaints are as follows (if they are valid or not?)

#1. Would not help me or entertain any ideas to fix any issues or even own up to any issues that need to be fixed.*

#2 Misspell/mislabeled name on one die.*

#3 Don’t fit my press without the use of extended SH.**

* NO RETURNS EXCEPT ON QUALITY GUARANTEE

** WE OFFER CUSTOM DIE MANUFACTURING FOR YOUR SPECIFIC NEEDS.

The above asterisk lines are a copy paste from Neil’s website.
There is no guarantee on quality (subjective to what quality means to Neil, customer opinion does not matter or count). So much for custom dies manufactured for my specific needs. Neil’s website is not on inaccurate, but he doesn’t have any disclaimer about his dies will not work with a “junky” Hornady press.

The last problem found with frosting the cases and more pressure required to size than normal came up after NeiL rejected the thought of returning the dies to fix them up, correct the spelling. I cannot honestly hold that against NeiL but as I stated earlier in this thread, if he won’t fixed an error on his part like the name/label that is clearly his own doing, why would he do anything with this issue. Only an assumption on my part. A third party is now involved, we will see what happened. I did call Hornady and left a message to get prices on their custom dies just incase NeiL eats this job so that I am fully prepared to get moving on it right away. It’s been over a year now since this adventure started. I have never had to have someone else get involved to help me resolve an issue with another person.

Lastly, an elderly gentleman just told me he called Neil within the last year to make dies for a wildcat and was belittled and treated very poorly so didn’t have Neil make them.

[georgeld]

Kinda sounds like my buddy Gary that owned a sheet metal shop
had me print out for him once.

Re: "Refunds are Optional: "MY OPTION!"

Hope the cc lady said you were still within their time limits.
Never heard of having to fill out papers though. But, I've only used
local credit unions and debit cards as I won't use a credit card
due to the rip off % rates, I waste enough money on my own doings.

Best wishes, and if you don't want to put it out here, send it to my e'mail is fine.

I also learned the hard way quickly in business.
That you can't stay in business long if you're 100% honest.
Too many will do what they can to screw you over.
Especially those that spout their religion first thing.
Though I tried real hard to be honest and allow all the slack I could.

Think you long timers here have read enough of my bs to know how I feel about lots of things.
I've always had the knack of p'g folks off.
Years ago if they were in reach I'd bust 'em first!
Since the law has cracked down on those things I've tried to stay out of reach of them.

Cheers, and happy new year!, hope like hell this one's better all around.

[GLWenzl]

The finished product. These are 17 Jet... 17 WS look very similar.

[Bill K]

Then, from the photo's, this means all is working out correctly ? And you are getting the project going as you wanted ?

[GLWenzl]

Yes, got them to work somewhat.

#1 Forming dies - Can’t say they are a huge improvement over my homemade forming dies. They form brass and that’s it.

#2 17 Jet- The die I got from Paul Rogers is much smoother and I’d prefer to use it over Neil’s die.

#3 17 Wenzl Special die is much better than I had (in a way). Because I didn’t have one, so would size neck and shoulders with a 17 Jet die and the lower body with a 357 mag die.

Other than the name issue, the brass frosting up and requiring additional force to size and form cases compared to anything else, they get the job done.

That said they are in the box ready to return. I called my cc company last week snd they have refunded my account and are doing an investigation.

[georgeld]

Sounds good on the card acct.

Now it's up to Neil Jone's what happens next.

Glad you got it done Gary. Beats being frustrated and
in a jacked up mood over things.

At least this much of it IS in YOUR control.

Hope it's "happy endings" haha!

Nice looking cartridge. Believe Paul sent me one similar among
a half dozen or so of his play toys. Including that .17/.25 acp.

When I got sick, i had 30 some .17's guys on here sent me to compare.
Had them in a dish on the dining table. No clue where they went along
with half a truck load of other stuff and six guns.

I have found a few things tossed behind the pile of s--t in the back room.
Two chamber reamers were in that bag too. Mark D's version of .17VR
and a brand new .300 RUM with several bore collars I'd turned, one for the .358 I was in the middle of.

Now that's tricky lathe work! Much similar to turning the spacer ring
on an ink pen. Try it sometime!

[GLWenzl]

Thanks George, I am getting over it but still not how I prefer to take care of business and really wish NeiL could have someone helped me find resolution to the issues.

Amazing how therapeutic those little cases can me lol!

Nice work on the spacer George. I actually made a couple of small things but not that small. Once I made a spacer/shim to fit a weaver match chambered 22-250, Rem 700 barrel fit an old Winchester model 70 to headspace correctly. Call it my Remchester. Picking up on the minor diameter of the Remington threads after turning off most of the winchester threads to the major diameter was above my pay grade! The shim took some trail and error but I eventually got a great headspace.

The other time I did something similar was when I had Fred run a 17 Jet reamer in deep and the reamer had the rim built into it. Afteri convinced him to consider doing it, head spacing on the shoulder, he agreed and said it would be ok. But I had second thoughts about it and decided to build an interference fit spacer to take up the clearance. Getting the width was easy but ending up with the correct ID was the scary part. Once again I get lucky and you would have to look hard to see the parting line and the ID turned out perfect.

The poor mans way of doing things but it was all fun.

[Tparrish]

Maybe if Neil has to start eating some more $800 problems, maybe his customer service will improve, just my thoughts.

Tom

[georgeld]

Tom:

Things like this don't take long to get someone's attention
Hope it works into fixing and not what I expect as more attacks.

Gary: I ran a lathe 3 yrs back when I was 23 or so. Got pretty hot stuff
on it. After bitching about the slack in the 10x36 Atlas.
I came in one Monday and had a brand new Harding chucker. I was so
pleased I had to go home and change my panties!!

I tuned seat adjusting pins for the 2nd and third manned space flights.
Then they tested my ability to the max. SS 1/2" rod, 2" long, slotted head,
main bearing boss, three throws of a crank shaft, main bearing, then 3/8" of 1/4"x28 threads. All within .0005", each step itself was .0002". Oh yeah, it all had to have "25 finish", that's equal to a mirror, flawless. Sharpened my own
bits too.

This was about 6 months in. I'd go home at night and have the shakes for
2-3 hours coming off the tension. After a couple months it got where I couldn't keep my food down. Company doc proved I had an ulcer over it. Took me off that onto a 30"x8' 6 position turret that couldn't keep within half inch tolerance. A few months later the plant shut down. My next job was long haul trucking!!

I haven't had access to a lathe til I bought this one about 9 yrs ago. Wish I
felt good enough to run it more. Real shame having $4-5,000 sitting out there collecting dust.

I've turned two tapered barrels for Blackhawks. My first tapers, came out just right. Maybe one day I'll try a rifle barrel. It has the guides for long turns.
Enco 13x40, geared.