lilgun problem in fireball

[Jerryv]

Been meaning to post this for a while, but haven't gotten around to it until now.

Has anyone else encountered inconsistent results with lilgun powder in a .221 fireball? I picked up an LVSF a while back and reloading supplies for it. I know lilgun is supposed to be terrific in the Hornet and had seen it recommended for the Fireball so I thought I would give it a try. With 45gr Sierra's the Hodgdon site lists Starting 13.8 gr 2,964 fps 39,300 CUP Max 15.3gr 3,202 fps 49,000 CUP

I put together five at 14.5 gr and five at 15.1 gr. The 15.1 shot great and looked good so I loaded up a box of fifty. These worked great shooting rabbits, but several showed high pressure signs, one even blowing the primer. Needless to say, I quit when that happened. It was cold out so I don't think temperature caused it.

I just noticed that the Hodgdon data lists a Rem 7 1/2 primer and I was using a Rem 6 1/2. Could this cause inconsistent ignition which might explain it?

Just wondering if anyone else has had issues like this.

Thanks
Jerry

[CatShooter]

Originally Posted by Jerryv

Been meaning to post this for a while, but haven't gotten around to it until now.

Has anyone else encountered inconsistent results with lilgun powder in a .221 fireball? I picked up an LVSF a while back and reloading supplies for it. I know lilgun is supposed to be terrific in the Hornet and had seen it recommended for the Fireball so I thought I would give it a try. With 45gr Sierra's the Hodgdon site lists Starting 13.8 gr 2,964 fps 39,300 CUP Max 15.3gr 3,202 fps 49,000 CUP

I put together five at 14.5 gr and five at 15.1 gr. The 15.1 shot great and looked good so I loaded up a box of fifty. These worked great shooting rabbits, but several showed high pressure signs, one even blowing the primer. Needless to say, I quit when that happened. It was cold out so I don't think temperature caused it.

I just noticed that the Hodgdon data lists a Rem 7 1/2 primer and I was using a Rem 6 1/2. Could this cause inconsistent ignition which might explain it?

Just wondering if anyone else has had issues like this.

Thanks
Jerry

The Remington 7-1/2 is a high pressure primer designed for the 223 and others (including the .221 Furball).

The 6-1/2 is a medium pressure primer designed for the 22 Hornet and the 357 Magnum.

You are using the wrong primer. Switch to 7-1/2's.

[squirrel_slayer]

I've heard that lil gun can have lot to lot inconsistencies quite frequently.

[JohnHenry]

Agree with CatShooter. The 7 1/2 primer has a thicker cup than the 6 1/2 (.025 versus .020). A number of powders work well with the Fireball, but I have had particularly good results with the Hodgdon max load of CFE BLK and the Nosler 40 gr BT. Hodgdon data indicates higher velocities and lower pressures with CFE BLK versus LIL'Gun. As I worked up to the max CFE BLK load, accuracy improved.

[SmokinJoe]

Agree with others that you have the wrong primer for 221FB pressures. I have used the old nickel plated WSR for years, but I am finally out of those and ran a short test of new primers to use. Tried new WSR, Fed 205, CCI 400. The CCI 400 gave me the best ES/SD and equivalent velocity, so I would recommend them. I have used Lil'Gun @ up to 16.0 grs w/40V-Max and it was quite a performer, but settled on AA1680 at a little over 20 grs and it performs just as well and seems more consistent. Would help to know what rifle you are shooting. 221FB is a great little cartridge.

[varmintshooter]

Yes I did have issues with Lilgun in my 221 fb. I worked up to 16gr and was at 3600 and pretty happy but then started to see fliers, some far out of the group. I ended up trying H4198, 1680 and Rl-7. My buddy is still using LG and is happy. H4198 gave good accuracy but was quite a bit slower.

[Bayou City Boy]

Originally Posted by SmokinJoe

Agree with others that you have the wrong primer for 221FB pressures. I have used the old nickel plated WSR for years, but I am finally out of those and ran a short test of new primers to use. Tried new WSR, Fed 205, CCI 400. The CCI 400 gave me the best ES/SD and equivalent velocity, so I would recommend them. I have used Lil'Gun @ up to 16.0 grs w/40V-Max and it was quite a performer, but settled on AA1680 at a little over 20 grs and it performs just as well and seems more consistent. Would help to know what rifle you are shooting. 221FB is a great little cartridge.

The OP stated that he has a LVSF rifle (stainless Rem 700 with a 22" barrel) .

-BCB

[SEM]

I have noticed quite a bit of inconsistent capacity with Remington cases of old more so than later made, with near max loads of LilGun I can get a .25 group and the next group will be .75 with one flier then 3 groups later 1.25 frustrated me until I weighed and sorted the cases got way better groups then

[Bill K]

Lil'gun is a old favorite powder for many of the smaller case's, hornet, etc. and it is a good one. However it also is critical that you work up loads slow and easy, just a tenth grain can all of sudden, spike into to high pressure.

As to your 17 Fire ball, work up some loads with either CFE BLK or CFE 223 and you will find a very accurate and stable load, along with fine accuracy and FPS. And us a thicker cupped primer i.e. Rem 7.5 or equivalent. Bill K

[TinMan]

I have had too much lot-to-lot variation with Lil'Gun, and stopped using it in small bores. I still like it in heavy loads of 45 Colt. For the 221FB, try RL7 or AA2200.