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  #1  
Old 01-26-2020, 02:12 AM
squirrel_slayer squirrel_slayer is offline
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Default Making a 22 cal pistol round. lightest bullets available?

Hello all, I decided to pursue an idea i've had for about a decade now. I've always liked the FN 5.7 pistol (or the concept at least) but it's always been way to expensive to consider. Yes I know ruger is bring a more affordable option to the market but I have always wanted a 9mm sized gun with said performance.

I have been playing with my 22 Mamba wildcat (.223 based 1.125" case, improved 30' shoudler, ect...) for awhile now.

Being that I have the die reamer for said cartridge I decided to make a shortened version of the cartridge. I initially stopped at a case length of .935" but that limited me to short stubby bullets like the 22 TCM which is cool and all. Case capacity was 14.3gr....not shabby. how much more can we do?....

So I went all the way down to .860" and case forming wasn't bad at all. cases still dropped into a case gauge without issues(the case has minimal taper) Ordered up some 34gr nosler fbhp's (aka dogtown usa) and viola!


Trying to see if you guys know of lighter bullets that would work in this cartridge. preferably lead based as the lead free bullets are long for their weight and would be slower.

I managed to refine my case forming process and have it down to 4 steps.

1. I push the shoulder back 80% of the way with a die I made with the chamber reamer

2. Final size the case with the short die I made with my die reamer

3. I grab a case, drop it into the jig I made let the lathe spin it on for me then part the neck with a .060" parting tool I ground

4. I ream the necks with a .221" reamer to remove excess material (it's quite a bit!!!)

Repeatability was less than .001" so very impressed with that.

I made 50 cases start to finish in about an hour.

The lathe operations take ~30 sec a case including inserting and removing. Made a video if interested. https://imgur.com/d2ZLDjp

Comparison's L-R: 5.7x28, .935" case w/40gr jhp, .860" case w/34gr fbhp, .865" case w/40gr sp, 22 TCM case
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  #2  
Old 01-26-2020, 04:18 AM
georgeld georgeld is offline
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Default

Looks like fun.

You should have been on here about ten years ago.
when Paul Rogers: aka: Rogervich or such was around.

All these have been done before. Hate to pop your balloon.

Paul made just about all of 'em: from .25acp even, Re: skeeter.
"worthless". still he shot it and many others.

Couple versions of 32's and 9mm's.

I have a collection of 17 cal cases various guys sent me. some over
33 of 'em.

Like i said,: they've all been done before. Still will give you something to
do in your spare time and maybe have some fun. Until you blow things up.

Don't know the powder you used to get that much in the case. I blew a .17VR
up with 10.2 gr H110.

Go mighty easy and one tenth grain at a time increase In these little cases.
Just because they're real small, don't mean they don't still have the full
pressure when set off.

Be safe, then have fun, Wear goggles and ear plugs.
__________________
George

"Gun Control is NOT about guns,
it's about CONTROL!!"
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  #3  
Old 01-26-2020, 04:38 AM
squirrel_slayer squirrel_slayer is offline
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Oh I wasn't trying to make anything "new" so to speak.

I know there isn't anything new under the sun as they say.

I just didn't have the capabilities to try these types of things until about 4-5 years ago when I got my lathe.

My 22 Mamba is still a fairly small cartridge and I hear ya on powder charges. I usually go .2gr at a time with it (17.1gr H2o capacity, the .223 short I played with before it was 16.3gr capacity) I had velocity boosts of nearly 100 ft/sec with a .2gr increase.

I plan on measuring web expansion as I go and i'm going to use a stiffer recoil spring for the workup, likely in a vice with a string on the trigger with all the PPE.

I also have QL to "track" the pressure. I've learned that XX grains increase translates into XX gains and when those gains start to taper off or spike your done and go back a step. (lil gun is notorious for that build, build, build, velocity drops rapidly...woah stop!!)

I'm more after your guy's wisdom if there are lighter bullets out there.

Or can bullets like the 30gr v-max for the 22 magnum be sourced somewhere?

This is however my first rodeo for a wildcat in a pistol. So it is kinda taboo to me. but I enjoy a challenge so long as I do it safely.
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  #4  
Old 01-26-2020, 01:33 PM
ray h ray h is offline
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Squirrel,nice case. Good idea to ream necks in a case die. Are you planning to outside neck turn to true up the necks. Years ago I did some ''what if's'' on the 9mm and the 9mm Win Mag but never went any further than the forming different lengths. Keep us posted as you go, well done. George I immediately thought of Paul when I seen this too. I miss his posts.
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Old 01-26-2020, 03:32 PM
squirrel_slayer squirrel_slayer is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ray h View Post
Squirrel,nice case. Good idea to ream necks in a case die. Are you planning to outside neck turn to true up the necks. Years ago I did some ''what if's'' on the 9mm and the 9mm Win Mag but never went any further than the forming different lengths. Keep us posted as you go, well done. George I immediately thought of Paul when I seen this too. I miss his posts.
Thanks Ray, Being that this is for a pistol and they currently look to be pretty concentric I probably wont worry about neck turning.

However if accuracy is poo I assume I could make a mandrel to put it on the center and make a case die that just holds the shoulder so all of the neck is exposed and clean them up.

My reamer is spec'd for thick necks for ease of case forming in the 22 Mamba. (ie. an average of neck thickness measured from cases at 1.125" was used to spec the neck diameter) so if I thin them out too much i'll be working the brass pretty hard and i'm sure neck cracks will come sooner.
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  #6  
Old 01-26-2020, 04:41 PM
GrocMax GrocMax is offline
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Those wide open tip slugs had trouble feeding in my 5.7. Had to use soft point or poly tip. The 34g was worth a couple hundred FPS though.
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  #7  
Old 01-26-2020, 05:28 PM
squirrel_slayer squirrel_slayer is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rickiesrevenge View Post
What pistol are you going to build this for? A long time ago I thought about doing the same type of thing for a 17 or 20 cal. Never got around to doing it.

Aaron
I'm going to be using a polymer80 built glock 34


Was playing with quick target and it shows a MPBR of 150yds and that's only +/- 1" MPBR even at 200 yds it's only down 8". should make for some fun in the squirrel fields.

If your trying to do a 17 or 20 in a auto loader the 20 may work but I want to say the 17's just don't have enough energy to cycle the slides. Real Guns made a 17 caliber 357 sig many years back and they could never get it to cycle.

Thanks for the heads up on the tips of the 34's Groc. it is pretty big and deep for that matter.

I really wish hornady would sell their 30gr v-max. those puppies would move out of this cartridge!
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  #8  
Old 01-26-2020, 06:57 PM
TinMan TinMan is offline
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I think Berger made a 30gr HP at one time. I tried them in a 22 Hornet. Not sure if they are still made.
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  #9  
Old 01-26-2020, 11:01 PM
MIBULLETS MIBULLETS is offline
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I think James Calhoon makes a 30 gr hollow point.
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  #10  
Old 01-27-2020, 12:54 AM
squirrel_slayer squirrel_slayer is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rickiesrevenge View Post
Are you going to stub the barrel or machine in from a fat barrel?
Stub. I don't have a mill..although I do have limited access to one.

Actually started on it this afternoon. Got the blank profiled, chambered, and threaded.

got the breach block dialed in, bored and ready to thread.
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