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  #21  
Old 07-20-2020, 04:38 AM
georgeld georgeld is offline
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I almost never buy less than jugs full.
Saves a lot of hassles.
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  #22  
Old 07-20-2020, 03:04 PM
admiral admiral is offline
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I bought an 8# jug of IMR 4198 about 5 years ago. It has the typical black IMR color and grain size for 4198. It also says manufactured in Australia on the label.
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  #23  
Old 07-20-2020, 04:23 PM
218bee 218bee is offline
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I bought a 1lb from a local store a couple of months ago and it looks the H series with the green/yellow tint, not all black. I am not sure how long the store has had it.
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  #24  
Old 07-20-2020, 06:15 PM
moorepower moorepower is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TinMan View Post
In my opinion, the powder manufacturers blend their cannister grades to make specific levels/blends of properties. That is what becomes a cannister grade so it can be consistent between cans you can buy. I have seen RL-7 with scattered grains of both red and green grains along with the grey grains. Any time you get a new cannister, it is Smart to back the charge off a bit, test and load back up to the level you require.
Words of wisdom. Always work up when switching to a new container with a different lot number.
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  #25  
Old 07-23-2020, 12:48 PM
rider rider is offline
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I have not received a response from my inquiry to Hodgdon yet. I will update if they respond.
Rider
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  #26  
Old 07-23-2020, 06:38 PM
Johnly Johnly is offline
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I've noticed that that non-temperature stable powder was black in color, while the "extreme" versions had a yellow tint and were lighter in color.
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  #27  
Old 07-23-2020, 07:25 PM
Bayou City Boy Bayou City Boy is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Johnly View Post
I've noticed that that non-temperature stable powder was black in color, while the "extreme" versions had a yellow tint and were lighter in color.

Each year I shoot pd's in the Texas panhandle during the hot summer months. I shoot my 17 Rem rifles a great deal. My standard IMR4198 load is producing just over 4K fps at the muzzle from a 24" barrel, winter or summer. So it is not a light load. Its a relatively warm load (not maximum) that gives exceptional accuracy.

If IMR4198 is temperature sensitive, I haven't seen it. I will add however, that any ammunition left sitting in the sun for an hour or more is likely to be "sensitive" at best, regardless of the powder used. My ammo never sits in the direct sun while I'm pd shooting.......... I do and see the same thing with 221 FB loads where I have used H4198 in the past.

Maybe "Extreme" is more of a marketing point than an actual thing, that attracts those who tend to let their ammunition "warm up" in the sun. If you protect the ammo from direct hot sunlight, I don't think that "Extreme" or "Not Extreme" means diddly... At least with IMR4198 it hasn't for me since the mid 1970's. In addition, this same pd load works great in the same 17 Remington rifles when I'm up north hunting coyotes in sometimes below zero conditions in January and February. I have no idea if it makes a difference for ammo heated by the sun as I've never tried playing that game.

Just my experience.

-BCB
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Last edited by Bayou City Boy; 07-23-2020 at 07:30 PM.
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  #28  
Old 07-23-2020, 08:01 PM
moorepower moorepower is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bayou City Boy View Post
Each year I shoot pd's in the Texas panhandle during the hot summer months. I shoot my 17 Rem rifles a great deal. My standard IMR4198 load is producing just over 4K fps at the muzzle from a 24" barrel, winter or summer. So it is not a light load. Its a relatively warm load (not maximum) that gives exceptional accuracy.

If IMR4198 is temperature sensitive, I haven't seen it. I will add however, that any ammunition left sitting in the sun for an hour or more is likely to be "sensitive" at best, regardless of the powder used. My ammo never sits in the direct sun while I'm pd shooting.......... I do and see the same thing with 221 FB loads where I have used H4198 in the past.

Maybe "Extreme" is more of a marketing point than an actual thing, that attracts those who tend to let their ammunition "warm up" in the sun. If you protect the ammo from direct hot sunlight, I don't think that "Extreme" or "Not Extreme" means diddly... At least with IMR4198 it hasn't for me since the mid 1970's. In addition, this same pd load works great in the same 17 Remington rifles when I'm up north hunting coyotes in sometimes below zero conditions in January and February. I have no idea if it makes a difference for ammo heated by the sun as I've never tried playing that game.

Just my experience.

-BCB


It could have something to do with when you work up your loads also. Some powders drop off more in the cold weather. If I were to work up a load in the spring in Nebraska it might be 35f when I got to the range. When I went to TX in Feb., we were in shorts and tee shirts when we were not in the Gauntlet you folks call thickets. I can't speak for IMR 4198, because as of yet I have never tried it, but I do have a pound. I can tell you that I would not want to work up a load for a .243 with H414, even though my 788's like it, and go to west Texas in the summer and sit out shooting PDogs, because I would be popping primers. RL17 compared to RL16 is another good example, where RL17 will really jump up in psi and RL16 is much more stable with nearly the same burn rates. That's why I always do my load work for PDogs at 80f or above. Like you I keep the rounds cooler by keeping them in the shade, and I don't let them set in the chamber long either.
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  #29  
Old 07-24-2020, 02:25 AM
Bayou City Boy Bayou City Boy is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by moorepower View Post
It could have something to do with when you work up your loads also. Some powders drop off more in the cold weather. If I were to work up a load in the spring in Nebraska it might be 35f when I got to the range. When I went to TX in Feb., we were in shorts and tee shirts when we were not in the Gauntlet you folks call thickets. I can't speak for IMR 4198, because as of yet I have never tried it, but I do have a pound. I can tell you that I would not want to work up a load for a .243 with H414, even though my 788's like it, and go to west Texas in the summer and sit out shooting PDogs, because I would be popping primers. RL17 compared to RL16 is another good example, where RL17 will really jump up in psi and RL16 is much more stable with nearly the same burn rates. That's why I always do my load work for PDogs at 80f or above. Like you I keep the rounds cooler by keeping them in the shade, and I don't let them set in the chamber long either.

I have shot leftover 17 Rem hand loads from winter coyote hunting at pd's in the summer. I never have anything left after a summer of pd shooting so that everything that I shoot at northern winter coyotes is loaded prior to those trips. I spent 9 years living in West Texas so I'm very familiar with loading and shooting there. After 9 years an oil company told me that my checks would start going to Houston so I should move there so that I could cash them. So I and my family "got moved", free of expenses, way back in 1989.

The 17 Remington load that I use remains constant for whatever I'm doing year 'round, and it has remained constant since the 1970's through Montana, West Texas, and the Texas Gulf Coast. In addition, when loaded at any time during the year, the loads shoot to the same point of impact summer and winter. The load that I use involves a very warm but not maximum load of IMR4198 with 25 grain Hornady HP bullets. Velocity with the load is great but accuracy is more than great in every 17 Remington rifle I've shot it in, both factory and custom rifles.

btw - some thing are all relative to where you live. February in South Texas is what we call winter on the Gulf Coast. One day here might be 75 degrees, and if a "blue norther" blows through overnight, tomorrow might be 40 degrees with high humidity because low pressure sucks in humidity from the Gulf. Coming from Nebraska, ya'll still might be in shorts and t-shirts until you go outside down here, but its not even close to summer in Texas for someone from here... People from dry climates have a tough time understanding that 35-40 degrees with 70% humidity and a 5 mph breeze will freeze you beyond belief. Not literally, but try convincing your mind of that.... And that comes from a person who grew up in Wyoming and who attended UW in Laramie where 40 mph breezes, 10 degrees, with snow falling sideways were very common. But the humidity was always low. West Texas is typically dry desert with relative humidity averaging about 7% all year long but it has real snow occasionally...

Moral: Loading based on the season might be highly over rated. At least my experience with IMR4198 in a 17 Remington says it is. YMMV.

-BCB
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