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  #21  
Old 10-12-2014, 03:27 PM
Daryl Daryl is offline
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My CZ 527's were a bit rough in the bolts when knew, but now after from 3,000 & over 10,000 rounds, they re both very slick- as nice even as my Sako L1 although a lighter bolt feel.
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  #22  
Old 10-12-2014, 03:34 PM
Dick Kohles Dick Kohles is offline
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Default O Ring?

1) The trick with the O-rings that holds the case pinned against the bolt face works a treat!


What is he talking about?
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  #23  
Old 10-12-2014, 09:26 PM
Dick Kohles Dick Kohles is offline
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Default 0 ring

Anyone know?
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  #24  
Old 10-12-2014, 09:41 PM
hemiallen hemiallen is offline
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The OP used a small diameter, small cross section -O- RING slid over the mouth/ bullet and slid down to the rim of each piece of Ammunition. It's purposed was to force the rim back against the boltface, VS setting up the brass with a crush fit, like I believe most do for wildcatting.

When I reform 22 hornet to either Ackley or HH chamberings I allow the brass to form a crush fit of the case to each rifle's chamber in order to force the base of the ammunition against the boltface. I also do this for my 20VT and reforming 221 FB to 17 FB.

Some say the firing pin strike can overcome this on thin brass, but my take is, crushing the brass is less than the poster's O-RING method, unless he uses a very firm Durometer O-ring...

I had a similar issue as Adam showed, but I stopped reloading when I saw the bright ring on the outside and used a sharpened, bent paper clip to feel the case separation ring inside the case, before actually making 2 pcs out of one piece of brass. I was setting the shoulder back when reloading, before I knew better... That was 30 years ago.

No offense to the OP, whatever works for a person is fine by me.

Allen
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  #25  
Old 10-12-2014, 10:52 PM
montdoug montdoug is offline
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Like you say Allen, whatever blows yer hair back . I think the majority just size the neck down to .20 and then size the forward part of the neck to .17 to create that crush fit we all speak of. I do that on most everything I form.

On the initial 400 some odd WW Hornet cases formed for my .17 Hornet they were first expanded from .22 to .25 to straighten the walls and then necked down is several steps using a Neil Jones busing die to set the shoulder position. The initial forming was done with a paper wad that formed the shoulder to final length and formed the case about 95%. These were all cases fired in a since sold rifle to start out with, most cases were formed on their second firing but the 1st batch of 50 that was the experimental batch were paper wad formed on their 5th firing and finish fire-formed on their 6th. In the initial 95% forming stage I think 3 to 5 of 400 cases were lost. In the final forming go round with a false shoulder in the neck for a crush fit on 20 Grain "Varmint Nightmare" gopher rounds the total of lost cases is zero. The total number of gophers splattered was significantly higher than that, with several rock chucks thrown in for good measure. The only way to fire-form cases IMO
I should add that on all firings both before forming as a .22 Hornet and after as a .17 Hornady Hornet all cases were neck sized only.
I'm to dense to really be able to picture the op's process but if it works then by all means use it.
Just my 2cents on this rainy Sunday afternoon .
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  #26  
Old 10-12-2014, 11:03 PM
Daryl Daryl is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by montdoug View Post
Like you say Allen, whatever blows yer hair back . I think the majority just size the neck down to .20 and then size the forward part of the neck to .17 to create that crush fit we all speak of. I do that on most everything I form.
Same here - most of my guns are wildcats. I've been shooting 9.3x62 since the early 80's, yet this spring was the first time I ever used 9.3x62 brass. The .375 IMP's- always .30/06, .270, or 35 Whelen brass to start. False shoulder, crush fit - zero case loss in well over 20 loads in each cartridge.

I do that same as Doug noted when making .17AH's.
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  #27  
Old 10-13-2014, 12:02 AM
fat cat fat cat is offline
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Default CZ

I have know idea what you guys are talkin about, but my Browns beat the Steelers toDAY so its all ok by me!! Happy Happy!
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  #28  
Old 10-13-2014, 12:36 AM
Tilleyman Tilleyman is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ab_bentley View Post
If you're not creating a false shoulder and have crush fit on the shoulder when fire forming you will have case head separations.


Adam
This table helps illustrate the rim thickness variability between Hornady factory 17 Hornet brass and most of the commonly available 22 Hornet cases potentially able to be used for reforming to 17 Hornet...
Note Chicken Thief is using RWS cases to reform, they have the second thickest rims of all those measured (same as Hornady factory 17 Hornet) so headspace clearance may be already be minimal.



As to Chicken Thief's negative points on the CZ527 so eloquently outlined

The bolt and raceway IS a little rough and gritty when first checked out-of-the-box, but can easily be smoothed up. Field strip the bolt and remove the extractor, mount it in soft jaws in a vice and use some fine emery tape (lubricated with kero) shoe-shine fashion around it to remove the fine annular machining marks.
Polish the extractor claw to remove the slight ridge to allow the rim of the case to ride up smoothly.
Flush away grit with solvent, oil and reassemble.

Use fine (320 to 400 grit) wet and dry paper wrapped around a suitable diameter smooth steel rod to remove machining marks from the bolt raceway in the receiver.

The flat part of the raceway can also be smoothed using suitable toolmaker's stones lubricated with kero to remove broaching marks and galling etc.

If you really want a smooth action then apply a little fine valve grinding paste and lap the raceways to the bolt body. Be VERY careful to clean all abrasives out of the bolt and lug recesses or it could increase wear and potentially affect headspace.

The magazines ALL need stripping and the feed lips draw filed using a fine round file then wet sanded with progressively finer wet and dry, then polished to a mirror finish with a small mop in a Dremel tool.

Fit of the magazines can be tuned by carefully filing the top of the 'bump' on the rear face so the magazine catch just clicks in perfectly.

So a bit of tuning will lead to as LOT of improvements to an already very accurate rifle

Last edited by Tilleyman; 10-13-2014 at 03:13 AM. Reason: Expanded for clarification..
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  #29  
Old 10-13-2014, 02:37 AM
Bayou City Boy Bayou City Boy is offline
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I'm going to stick with a false neck/crush fit to fire form new brass from old and leave o-rings for hydraulic seals.............

For the first 50 17 HH brass that I made I simply necked down WW once fired 22 Hornet brass to 17 in my Hornady 17 HH FL die and left the 22 caliber neck as a false shoulder for a crush fit, trimmed all of the cases to 1.355" per Tillyman, and fire formed them in my garage using Unique and toilet paper wad bullets to fire form. I re-killed a few dead bugs on the garage floor in the process.

The fire formed brass came out at right around 1.346". Still using them after two full power loadings.

-BCB
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  #30  
Old 10-13-2014, 02:59 AM
ab_bentley ab_bentley is offline
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I see the O-Rings. Look at the cases.....




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